My 30's Model 85/Red panther

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gautrek
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 11:19 pm

My 30's Model 85/Red panther

Unread post by gautrek » Sat Aug 24, 2013 5:07 pm

Well the good news is that I popped over to London and picked my free frame and forks up. The bad news was that I did a 300 mile round trip and spent most of the day sat in traffic on the A14 and M11. We were on the A14 as i was dropping my mate and his kids off at Duxford and then the plan was to pop to London and get the frame and then meet up with them later and have a few hours there myself.

But some tosser had driven their car down a bank on the A14 so we stopped for an hour on that. This then meant I left London on the M11 coming back just as all of London was going away on holiday. ARRGGHHH. So I made a leisurely way up the M11 at about 5 to 25 MPH. I then ended up not actually getting to see the museum at Duxford as it wasn't worth the entry fee by the time I got back.

But today I had a dry run with all my bits to get some idea of what's needed and to try to plan a course of action. All of the bolts came apart and look to be reusable,apart from one fork spindle which has stripped the thread in the nut but may be salvageable with a die. Which is not bad considering that the guy who gave me the frame rescued it out of a skip about 20 years ago.

So here is the first build.
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I did notice a few issues straight away. I think the frame must be a very early RP one as the gearbox slots and holes in the engine plates are 3/8" and not 1/2" like my box and bolts. Also the rear tank mount is about 3" closer to the steering head than on my tank which was fitted to my 37 RP.Note the optional positive stop footchange fitted to the gearbox. I will be removing this and making the bike hand change.

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A head on shot.
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The forks still bounce around and look to be mostly free. I may have issues with the damper adjusters. But plenty of penetrating oil will be used before I attempt to remove them.

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and here is what I consider to be one of the best bits on the frame :D :D :D :D

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I do need to have a think about what i do with this shop plate. Do I leave it as is and just put it back on our have a go at cleaning it up?
I am well chuffed as this bike stands me at about £200 at the moment.
1937 350cc Red Panther trial bike
1975 650cc Ural outfit(http://www.russianbike.co.uk/)
1983 R80 BMW.

coming soon a 1938 model 85 350 cc Redwing Panther(when I get it rebuilt)

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Hooli
Posts: 10183
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 11:52 pm
Location: Doncaster

Re: My 30's Model 85/Red panther

Unread post by Hooli » Sun Aug 25, 2013 2:05 pm

That's gonna be lovely & damn cheap so far 8-)
Classics ain't built in Metric

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gautrek
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 11:19 pm

Re: My 30's Model 85/Red panther

Unread post by gautrek » Sun Aug 25, 2013 10:31 pm

Well its gone up by £40 now as I snapped up a fairly good rear hub on fleabay last night.The brake is on the RH side on these rear hubs and the sprocket on the left so wheel that can be made to fit and look fairly original are are rather limited. The rear brake is operated by a bloody long cable from the lever which is mounted on the stud sticking out of the LH front engine plate which then has to cross over the bike to the the rear drum. its about 5ft long.
1937 350cc Red Panther trial bike
1975 650cc Ural outfit(http://www.russianbike.co.uk/)
1983 R80 BMW.

coming soon a 1938 model 85 350 cc Redwing Panther(when I get it rebuilt)

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gautrek
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 11:19 pm

Re: My 30's Model 85/Red panther

Unread post by gautrek » Wed Sep 04, 2013 10:36 pm

I am making slow progress at the moment. I am doing all the hidden stuff. Like making new brake cams and getting the hubs bored out to take 6203 bearings. This then involves new spindles and spacers. I am taking the hand change lever to work tomorrow to ream the pivot bush out and then I will make a new pivot bolt. The rear hub arrived and today I tried fitting my brake plate. The bloody shoes don't fit.So a bit of tweaking is needed. I think I will need a thinner brake cam. All my bits are being made out of stainless (which is free at work) :D I would post some photos but there is not a lot to see.

I have also drilled and filed out the gearbox mounts so my box now actually fits the plates i have also ran a die down all the original studs that came with the frame and I will re use them. I am fitting new nuts and washers and in fact got a good deal with some trade packs of cycle thread nuts of flea bay. most of the threads on this bike are cycle thread.
1937 350cc Red Panther trial bike
1975 650cc Ural outfit(http://www.russianbike.co.uk/)
1983 R80 BMW.

coming soon a 1938 model 85 350 cc Redwing Panther(when I get it rebuilt)

scotduke
Posts: 5785
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2009 12:53 am

Re: My 30's Model 85/Red panther

Unread post by scotduke » Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:52 pm

Just spotted the dealer's plate. Stockwell Road is near where I live. It's been a long time since that was a dealer though I have heard of Pride & Clarke before.

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gautrek
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 11:19 pm

Re: My 30's Model 85/Red panther

Unread post by gautrek » Sat Sep 21, 2013 11:24 pm

I am looking into the gearbox at the moment to find out why its a bit stiff. It turns out I have a bent main shaft. So I am contacting the Panther owners club to see if they have one as they have a load of RP lightweight gearbox spares. If not I will have to twat it with something rather large to see if I can straighten it. I will also need to either helicoil all the threads or weld them and re drill them. There are various other bits that need ali welding on the cases.
But then the parts are 70 odd year old.
1937 350cc Red Panther trial bike
1975 650cc Ural outfit(http://www.russianbike.co.uk/)
1983 R80 BMW.

coming soon a 1938 model 85 350 cc Redwing Panther(when I get it rebuilt)

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gautrek
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 11:19 pm

Re: My 30's Model 85/Red panther

Unread post by gautrek » Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:29 pm

Talk about one step forward and three back. The bosses have been away in Spain this week so the factory has turned into a bike spares manufacturer. I have made various stainless parts for the bike including some gear box spacers to mount the box in the right position to line the chains up. I have left these a bit long as until I get a clutch I am not 100% certain of the correct position. While messing about with the box last night(its loosely bolted in the gearbox plates) I noticed my nice new stainless snail cams are nowhere near the footrest mount on which they are supposed to push against to move the gear box .
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That along with the fact that the free frame is 28mm tubing and not 32mm like my 37 frame and has a bush for a crank which is needed to clear a Sturmey Archer gearbox and it seems to have provision for a bolt type gearbox adjustment. It all points to it being an earlier frame. After consulting a panther forum it would appear that its a frame from around 1934. It is usable but it means altering a few things with the angle grinder. I would rather not chop this frame about.

But I have been emailed by a guy who is after an early frame of about this year and has a 37 frame which is what i need for a straight swap. So it would seem we can both end up as happy bunnies :D
1937 350cc Red Panther trial bike
1975 650cc Ural outfit(http://www.russianbike.co.uk/)
1983 R80 BMW.

coming soon a 1938 model 85 350 cc Redwing Panther(when I get it rebuilt)

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gautrek
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 11:19 pm

Re: My 30's Model 85/Red panther

Unread post by gautrek » Tue Oct 01, 2013 10:30 pm

I have just had a very nice package from the spares guy in the owners club. A brand new re manufactured gearbox main shaft for the sum of £50 along with a few other bits and bobs. I have also managed to track a complete clutch down as well. Things are moving on :D
1937 350cc Red Panther trial bike
1975 650cc Ural outfit(http://www.russianbike.co.uk/)
1983 R80 BMW.

coming soon a 1938 model 85 350 cc Redwing Panther(when I get it rebuilt)

User avatar
gautrek
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 11:19 pm

Re: My 30's Model 85/Red panther

Unread post by gautrek » Sat Nov 09, 2013 12:34 am

I have been making enquiries about getting some of the Pride and Clark plates made up. I have found an acid etcher who is will to do a run of them and I have been having a fair bit of interest on the panther forums as well. I managed to swap my frame for a later one (1937) so all my bits will fit without butchering the frame about. I also went to the Panther owners club AGM the other day and had a chat with the spares guy. it turns out the kickstart ratchet gear I am missing is as rare as rocking horse pooh as its a different size to the later boxes and the club hasn't got any made up yet.

But I was contacted a while ago about my ad in the VMCC journal for some other spares. I was offered a complete clutch and RP gearbox. Luckily I had the foresight to save his number. I contacted him on Thursday and am going to pop over on Sunday and pick them up. This box has the missing ratchet that I need so thats a result.
1937 350cc Red Panther trial bike
1975 650cc Ural outfit(http://www.russianbike.co.uk/)
1983 R80 BMW.

coming soon a 1938 model 85 350 cc Redwing Panther(when I get it rebuilt)

User avatar
gautrek
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 11:19 pm

Re: My 30's Model 85/Red panther

Unread post by gautrek » Sun Dec 15, 2013 11:36 pm

Well its starting to come together.
My gearbox is rebuilt, the magneto has been made to fit with a spacers underneath it and an adaptor to mount the gear, I have started knocking up my footrest mounts, and have spent today making gearbox mounts and lining everything up. Due mainly to the fact I have bit the bullet and purchased a throw away tipped turning tool. I can finally make stuff on my lathe with out getting pissed off with regrinding tools every 5 mins.
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here is the mag mounted(you can just about make out the ally spacers underneath it with one of my new stainless footrest mounts loosely in place.

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here you can see the old footrest mount I am using as a pattern with my new footrest (from the owners club) in place. You can also see the stainless snailcams and studs for the gearbox. The kickstart is an old one and I will be fitting a new one . The gearbox studs need shortening as I made them longer so I could adjust them when I knew the final length. I am now going to make a start on knocking up some new mag mounting straps. I have also sourced a set of tin primary chain cases of a later Panther to modify to fit this bike(£30 +P&P) so am well chuffed.

I have also been given permission to keep a couple of my bikes down the side passage way between the house and the garage. Once I get a good gate on the garden end I will start using this. :D
1937 350cc Red Panther trial bike
1975 650cc Ural outfit(http://www.russianbike.co.uk/)
1983 R80 BMW.

coming soon a 1938 model 85 350 cc Redwing Panther(when I get it rebuilt)

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